2.057 ready for download

[thyme]

Hi Seamless Friends
Very sorry I have not been on the forum for the last few days. Thanks barphe for filling in

2.057 ready for download
www4.tpg.com.au/users/gperrett/seamless3d/index.html

New Features for 2.057
Sampling a Pose for Interpolators
Barphe suggested Interpolators be able to record the pose of an av. Because I could see this would not be hard to implement if the ROUTEs from the interpolators to parts were reversed and because I much like keeping in with the spirit of trying to utilise the 3d window to assist programming I decided to add such a feature for 2.057.
This feature is relatively straight forward to use.
Set the freezeTime's time field to the time you want for the recorded pose.
Pose the avatar
Right click on the TimeSensor that is the source of the Interpolator's time and select samplePose.
Note:
You must not have any ROUTEs going to parts you want to pose that are active when posing the model or they will compete with any of your efforts to pose the model manually. Currently in Seamless3d when time is frozen using the freezeTime feature ROUTEs are sent in each frame so it is essential all ROUTEs going to parts you want to pose be first disabled if the timeSensor is active. This can be done by unchecking a TimeSensors enabled field.
Each part can be easily selected in the 3d window in wire frame mode by holding down control and clicking on a vertex belonging from the part you want to select.
Once a part is selected it can be oriented by holding down shift and right dragging with the mouse. Be careful not to hold down shift and left drag unless you want to change the position of the part.
The samplePose command causes only elements in the interpolators to be modified that are set to the same time (in the key field) as freezeTime's time.
samplePose can be used for both Orientation and Position Interpolators.

Using Interpolators this way make me see Interpolators in a new light. Interpolators used by taking many samples for a second makes me think of how Wallace and Grommet and clay animated effects are achieved. The animation may be jerky compared to what you would expect from RotAccelerators but I think when many frames are taken for a second this jerky kind of animation has a charm of its own. Though this is an art form that's I am sure would take time to develop the beaughty to this simple technique is there should be little more to it than creating the art.

Calculating a Pose for a RotAccelerator
Previous versions of seamless had a command "calculate acceleration for return" for RotAcclerators that calculates the amount of acceleration needed to return an animated sequence back to where it began. This command is used in the worm animation tutorial. For 2.057 I have added a simular feature to this but one where you can specify to what ever orientation you set the part it is connected to via a ROUTE. Thinking this might want to be used frequently and that it is in context to what element is selected (by the index) I have added a push button named calcForPose to trigger this command. Keeping things uniform I have also added a calcForReturn button which has the same functionality as the "calculate acceleration for return" command that could be selected from the scene tree menu.
calcForPose calculates the acceleration needed for the orientation to end at the sampled pose at the end of the decay phase. calcForPose is not affected by the freezeTime's time.

Reducing the Time to Setup an Animation Sequence.
Adding all the animation nodes needed to animate all the parts in a model and name them and set up all the ROUTEs from the time sensor to the interpolators has to takes up a good bit of time. To take out the drudgery here I added a new feature, setupAnimation. To use this feature right click on the Seamless node that owns the parts you want to animate and select setupAnimation. Then fill out all the fields to the names and types of nodes you want to use and press doIt. doIt should create a RotAcclerator or a OrientationInterpolator for each part in the skeleton, each one containing the name of the part concatenated with other characters specified in the setupAnimimation's control panel. A time sensor node is also created with ROUTEs going from it to all the RotAcclerators/OrientationInterpolators.
Because StaticParts should never be directly animated the setupAnimimation feature will not create any animation Nodes or ROUTEs for StaicParts.
Any unwanted animation nodes created can be deleted to avoid unwanted bloat. Deleting a node that has a ROUTE connected to it automatically results in the ROUTE being deleted with it.

Inserting and Deleting Elements
Though it was possible to insert or delete elements in any multiple field using only Seamless3d's GUI it was probably easier to do this sort of thing using a text editor if the element was not the last in the array. Because of this fact I have added a feature for the sole task of allowing elements to be deleted or inserted. To use this new feature right click on the name of a field belonging to multiple field and select element. When this feature is used for multiple fields belonging to a group (multiple fields that share the same background colour) all elements that share the same index will be dealt with simultaneously for a single operation.
Copying and pasting should only be attempted for identical types of fields. I have not yet made it so the user is prevented from attempting to copy and paste from different types and I have not yet tested it out well so please treat it with kids gloves

New enabled field added to ExitBuild
I have not written any where about ExitBuild nodes yet but they are straight forward to use. Place one any where in the build field and execution will stop at this node during a build cycle. ExitBuild nodes are useful for going back in time to edit build nodes earlier in the cycle.
I have wondered from time to time if there would be any value in an ExitBuild node being able to be turned off without deleting it. Bumpy recently suggested that he thought it would be good if it could so I have added an enabled field to the ExitBuild for 2.057.

New slope field added to RadialTug
Bumpy said the RadialTug can be more versatile when it has the option of being able to do sharper pointy tugs which I can see could have advantages and comes at very little cost speed wise. This option has been added by adding a slope field to the RadialTug. When left to the default setting of 1 tugs are smooth but when set to .5 sharp pointy tugs are possible. Values between .5 and 1 may be worth experimenting and may be values outside this range too. Values 0 or 2 will cease to work. The RadialTug is one of many nodes that has not been documented in any detail yet but it should be relatively easy to use. Its a lot like a SineTug node and like this node it is used in a SurfaceGenerator.

Bugs fixed
Paste ownership of part from the F10 menu worked before but after using it would temporally show the copied part's name on the pasted part's name and would show a warning message causing confusion to anyone not use to this bug. This is an old bug, one I have forgotten about for a number of months. I rediscovered it recently and got rid of it swiftly

There was a bug in previous versions that prevented a CopyPart node from using the same part for the source and destination. This has now been fixed.

Barphe brought my attention to a bug that existed since 2.049 that prevented the user from seeing the visual aid cylinder for the TransferBCyl build node. This has now been fixed.

Anyone is more than welcome to comment if they think a feature is awkward to use in seamless. I can not promise anything but it is likely I may be able to think a neater alternative. Seamless has got to a point where there are many possible ways it can be used many which are not written about yet.

Many thanks to barphe, bumpy, cush, griff, X and others who have given seamless feedback over the last few weeks.
kind regards to all
thyme

[griff]

Just in time for the weekend .

I like that .... work does not get in way of exploring stuff ;-)

griff

[thyme]

hi griff great to hear this, I wish you the best of luck and hope seamless behaves
After speaking to barphe about animation techniques and thinking more over things I am questioning now why I did not simply have the samplePose command insert new elements automatically if the timeFreeze's time does not match up to a key value in an interpolator. I did think about something along these lines before I went about adding the code but I was thinking there was something more to it or I saw problems for some reason I cant think of now I think I will upload a new version of seamless with this modification added soon. It wont change anything only mean there is less to concern one self with so should only simplify all there is to it I hope
thyme

[griff]

Well the *samplePose* worked ... no problems .

But one quick question that I have been meaning to ask ... is there a way to reset the avatar to a base position when I want to create a new animation

The avatar always seem to be in a position left over from previous animation cycle.

In other words can I zero everything with one click ?? Or do I have to add a base set of all the interpolators

griff

[thyme]

hi griff
If you simply want to reset all rotations to 0 1 0 0 this can be done by selecting resetRotations from the f10 menu or pressing the short cut keys Alt+R. A part owned by the Seamless node you want to reset or the seamless node it self must be selected for this command to work.
In the past I have played with the idea of adding an extra rotation field to Parts so that there is a default rotation field and a animation rotation field but I not sure If this would improve things or only add complexity. I have not experienced this issue as a big problem so far, resetRotations has so far been sufficient.
However for translations there is no such thing as a default position of 0 0 0 really because most translation values should be left to what ever they were set to. Some times I wonder if this is a problem when a position interpolator leaves an av not in the centre of the screen. I just thought freezeTime could be helpful here to reset to a specific pose in the animation. I hope there are always good enough work arounds but please let me know if you find it to be a problem and where it arrises.
kind regards
thyme

[griff]

"If you simply want to reset all rotations to 0 1 0 0 this can be done by selecting resetRotations from the f10 menu or pressing the short cut keys Alt+R."

In most cases I think that will do fine ... thanks

I can see the issue with translation

One other thought ... about convenience of use not a problem.

It would be nice to be able to group all the interpolators and the associated time into one "animation" that animation would be like a "directory" that could be expanded (to show all interpolators and the timer) or closed (or folded up) to hide them.

The reason I mention this is starting on a new (fourth) animation I seem to be scrolling up and down a lot to see interploators and chosing body parts.

Using a kind of fold up group would help prevent all the scrolling. As I said though, is a convenience thing more than a building feature ... so don't let it sidetrack you from the real work ;-)

griff

[thyme]

Yes griff I can see how that could be a good way to hide clutter in the scene tree by only showing the animation nodes for the gesture that is being edited. Perhaps there should be a kind of TimeSensor added that is also a kind of group node for containing the Interpolators/Accelerators. This could easily be translated to standard code when output to a wrl. Bumpy has said a few times he thinks I should make it so nodes can collapse and expand. I can see how expanding/collapsing nodes is something worth taking advantage of when using nodes for building blocks but I have not done this yet because it would involve re designing at least some of the code for the scene tree window so will be a while unless I can think of a neat simple way to implement this in the meantime

"The reason I mention this is starting on a new (fourth) animation I seem to be scrolling up and down a lot to see interpolators and choosing body parts."

Instead of scrolling up the scene tree window to select a part consider taking advantage of the 3d window. Seamless lets you select any part by clicking on a vertex. Holding down control when you click prevents you from accidentally modifying the vertex. Pressing the short cut keys for copy Ctrl+C (or just R) works in the 3d window so it should be possible to add ROUTEs from Interpolators to any part never having to scroll up to a part. Remember also opening the control panel for a selected part (if the control panel is closed) can now be done by pressing Ctrl+F12

Did you try out the new feature setupAnimation to add a new gesture? this should save on a lot of scrolling work too.

Though I have not got my color background bug free yet (but wont cause a crash) you might want to try colouring the background nodes for the gesture you are working on a different color to the rest of the nodes so that you can more easily locate the nodes you are working on in the scene tree.

Thanks for sharing your experience and thoughts
thyme

[griff]

"Instead of scrolling up the scene tree window to select a part consider taking advantage of the 3d window. Seamless lets you select any part by clicking on a vertex. Holding down control when you click prevents you from accidentally modifying the vertex. Pressing the short cut keys for copy Ctrl+C (or just R) works in the 3d window so it should be possible to add ROUTEs from Interpolators to any part never having to scroll up to a part. Remember also opening the control panel for a selected part (if the control panel is closed) can now be done by pressing Ctrl+F12"

Probably shows you the difference in the way we work ;-)

griff <----- likes to maximise mouse use ... two finger typing typist ;-)

But going to give these suggestions a try

"but I have not done this yet because it would involve re designing at least some of the code for the scene tree window so will be a while unless I can think of a neat simple way to implement this in the meantime "

Don't worry about my suggestions .... they are really just process ideas for seamless ..... not about its *abilities*. An the abilities working well is much more important.

Just keep thoughts at back of your mind

griff

[thyme]

Yes I will keep this idea in my mind griff, have given it some more thought and wonder if it might not be so hard to implement as I thought before but still may be a while till I find the time knowing how computers are to progress with

I just had another idea griff that might solve the problem of being able to set a default position for a translation field. After thinking how avs that are built on the fly using build nodes are less likely to have this problem because the translation fields are set up each time they are built why not add a Place node to any av whether its built from scratch or not?
To do this Add a Place node to the Seamless's build field. Uncheck the Place's staticTransform first so that it does not modify the vertices only the translation field before you USE the part you want to set to a default value. Then USE the part and set the Place's translation field (rotation and scale are possible too).
Then all your have to do to set the default pose is press F9 the short cut key to manually create a build cycle.
Could be the best solution to this problem
Really happy to get this much feed back thanks
thyme

[Barphe]

First a bug in .057: Using a value other than 0 for tug radius will crash with a rude noise.

Im all for a dextrous tree window, I am very thankful for the pgup/pgdn keys. would love to see expandible/collapsable tree view. -- I have some projects with 30 OI's per gesture, upto 50 gestures between two figures, plus all the build fields, etc... the tree window gets pretty deep.

My solution: size the window so one gesture fits, and count my page key strokes. back and forth a few times and its no longer a problem

Counting clicks helps remember where your part belongs when you accidentally translate it also, but my solution to that is to keep a reference copy of the file I am working on open in vrmlPad. If I goof something up, I paste the proper values in from that. VP prompts to reload on every save.

I checked out the new animation features, and Im very excited about them. the freeztime has turned out to be very useful, btw. The setup Animation works like a charm, but av studio output has all those extra parts, and it made an OI for each one, but for scratch builds, I think, indespensible.

I tested the keyframer also with no troubles for simple 5 element Interpolators.

[griff]

An additional thought to idea of a collapsible tree for animations.

If set up as an *Animation/Time Node* that could be populated with *Setup Animation* and then values added to create an animation ... eg a 'jump' animation.

It would be nice to be able to *Save* just that animation, and then be able to *Load* it into another avatar (I realise that parts might need to be renamed in some way in some cases) ... and in the spirit of Seamless, shared with the community.

Potential is a library of animations available to the community .... a Seamless resource that would give some people who just use Av Studio an easy entry point into Seamless

It would be possible to create/dress an avatar in Avatar Studio, import it into Seamless, then add animations from the Seamless Library,. When they see how easy that is .... sure they will start experimenting with adding clothes and hair:)

griff

PS. Sorry if this is getting out of hand thyme

[Barphe]

Importing a gesture is as simple as cutting from the av studio wrl, and pasting it into the .smls file.

A drawback is that not all avstud avatars are the same, avatars with coats, glasses, etc have a different part structure, that makes you have to have more than one set of each gesture--one for each possible structure (!)

The beauty of seamless is that it makes the gestures much more universal, so any collection of avatars serves as such a library for the hand-coding capeable beginner...

Then expanding the gesture with hand, face, etc components... I find that you have to add morphers and import shapes, BEFORE you paste in the gestures. But you learn that right away

[thyme]

hi barphe
Thanks for pointing out the bug in regard to tugRadius I was not aware of it but thanks to you I have got rid of it for 2.059 which is now ready for download.
And thanks much to for sharing your tips and experience in animating an av in seamless and testing the new features.
When recording an animation sequence using the mouse to drag the rotations I can see it is to easy to translate a Part by mistake (but not much of a problem for avs built on the fly from build nodes because you only have to rebuild the av by pressing F9). Because most of the time only orientations are wanted what do you think of adding a SFBool enableDragTranslation field to the Settings node so that dragging the translation field can be disabled when using shift to drag? With this mode translations could still be done manually using the Part's control panel. Perhaps if translation used a different key to shift this problem could be solved differently but I think for assembling a world it would be nice to have the freedom of both orientations and translations without having to use different keys.
In Seamless one I had is so it could be put into a different mode to translate/rotate a part instead of the view using the mouse. (much like caps lock) Though this meant no key had to kept down I did not like this much because it made it awkward to keep toggling modes to change the view and was to easy to forget to check what mode it was in. My conclusion was It is much easier to get use to pressing shift when ever you want to control a part instead of control the view but I think having a mode to disable just the translation might be good since it may be left in this mode most of the time.

Great to hear you have taken to morphers, I was wanting to write about them following up from my build an av tutorial which is now some time ago I got to write about them soon!
thyme

[thyme]

hi griff
It is good to hear your enthusiasm and no it's not out of hand yet lol. Actually the idea of being able to import animation sequences from libraries is not far ahead for seamless because I have already done something very simular for importing build nodes that USE parts from a different file.
Some months ago I made Seamless so that it is now possible to import an arm for example from a file into an avatar.
(right click on a build node and select paste/sibling below/import/nodes from file )
This is not the same as simply importing the triangles for an arm, this is importing the build nodes that generate the triangles. The file that the arm is being imported to must contain identical named parts for any part USEd by the imported build nodes. None of the parts end up imported only the build nodes are but the names from the imported parts are used to tell which parts to USE in the av's skeleton. Though I have not yet done this for ROUTEs its much the same thing as importing USEd nodes.
You could have libraries of gestures made up from files containing an avatar with only one gesture each.
Though the Part nodes don't end up being imported they are needed in the library file to keep the USEs and/or ROUTEs legal unless a new kind of file was invented for this task but I think might as well have the Parts left in the file because the only problem I see is the extra file size added to the library and this I don't see much of a problem because there is the option of deleting all the triangles in the Parts. I think it might be desirable even to have the Parts stored with triangles in them (unless build nodes are used to generate the triangles on the fly) so that the gesture can be viewed from the library file before it is imported.

thyme